Comments on: Is Theft in the Eye of the Beholder? http://mattbalara.com/2006/10/is-theft-in-the-eye-of-the-beholder.html A blog about interfaces, design and doing things better. Mon, 08 Sep 2008 01:42:48 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.6 By: Martin http://mattbalara.com/2006/10/is-theft-in-the-eye-of-the-beholder.html#comment-9686 Martin Tue, 10 Oct 2006 14:24:14 +0000 http://mattbalara.com/design/is-theft-in-the-eye-of-the-beholder.html#comment-9686 nonono, I never said that solutionwatch or Steward has stolen anything. What I said is: they (all) base on the same effects (3-D), color schemes, gradients and and and and. Everything reminds me of anything. Sorry. The designs we are talking about are unique like chocolate ice cream with crunchy nuts! Oh, and BTW: has <a href="http://agenturblog.de/" rel="nofollow">Agenturblog</a> stolen anything from <a href="http://www.listible.com/" rel="nofollow">listible</a>? Or does he has the same idea? Who invented web 2.0 style elements? If there is a 1:1 site design, we can call it: design thief, but if there is any modification, it is not. Sad, but true. nonono, I never said that solutionwatch or Steward has stolen anything. What I said is: they (all) base on the same effects (3-D), color schemes, gradients and and and and. Everything reminds me of anything. Sorry.

The designs we are talking about are unique like chocolate ice cream with crunchy nuts!

Oh, and BTW: has Agenturblog stolen anything from listible? Or does he has the same idea? Who invented web 2.0 style elements?

If there is a 1:1 site design, we can call it: design thief, but if there is any modification, it is not. Sad, but true.

]]> By: Mb. http://mattbalara.com/2006/10/is-theft-in-the-eye-of-the-beholder.html#comment-9687 Mb. Tue, 10 Oct 2006 13:38:46 +0000 http://mattbalara.com/design/is-theft-in-the-eye-of-the-beholder.html#comment-9687 @<a href="http://mattbalara.com/design/is-theft-in-the-eye-of-the-beholder.html#comment-60" rel="nofollow">Dave</a> (very late): interesting. I wouldn't necessarily call the Netscape/Digg thing design theft. The overall impression of the pages based on colours, page structure, typography, etc. doesn't evoke an immediate "theft" reaction. Not in my eyes anyway. What they copied was more the function: list with headline, text, number of votes/diggs and misc. links. That's a function I've seen all over the place for a while now, e.g. <a href="http://www.listible.com/" rel="nofollow">Listible</a> is pretty similar, and <a href="http://www.newsvine.com/world-news" rel="nofollow">Newsvine</a> shows similar info and function organised slightly differently. Stuff like this bothers me less somehow. I have a feeling that Digg simply defined a sensible way to display functionality like this, and other sites have been using it, simply because it makes sense and works well, thereby establishing a kind of standard. @Dave (very late): interesting. I wouldn’t necessarily call the Netscape/Digg thing design theft. The overall impression of the pages based on colours, page structure, typography, etc. doesn’t evoke an immediate “theft” reaction. Not in my eyes anyway. What they copied was more the function: list with headline, text, number of votes/diggs and misc. links. That’s a function I’ve seen all over the place for a while now, e.g. Listible is pretty similar, and Newsvine shows similar info and function organised slightly differently.

Stuff like this bothers me less somehow. I have a feeling that Digg simply defined a sensible way to display functionality like this, and other sites have been using it, simply because it makes sense and works well, thereby establishing a kind of standard.

]]> By: Mb. http://mattbalara.com/2006/10/is-theft-in-the-eye-of-the-beholder.html#comment-9689 Mb. Tue, 10 Oct 2006 13:25:57 +0000 http://mattbalara.com/design/is-theft-in-the-eye-of-the-beholder.html#comment-9689 @Stewart: cool, direct from the horse's mouth so to speak. I can definitely see how your site *resembles* solutionwatch -- monochrome colour scheme, black/grey gradients -- but as I said above, that's nothing I'd call theft. There are more than enough differences there too. But the Faulkner/Joyent thing is a case of "squint and they're the same". Quite another deal altogether. @Stewart: cool, direct from the horse’s mouth so to speak.

I can definitely see how your site *resembles* solutionwatch — monochrome colour scheme, black/grey gradients — but as I said above, that’s nothing I’d call theft. There are more than enough differences there too.

But the Faulkner/Joyent thing is a case of “squint and they’re the same”. Quite another deal altogether.

]]> By: Stewart Curry http://mattbalara.com/2006/10/is-theft-in-the-eye-of-the-beholder.html#comment-9688 Stewart Curry Tue, 10 Oct 2006 13:13:03 +0000 http://mattbalara.com/design/is-theft-in-the-eye-of-the-beholder.html#comment-9688 @Mb. -> I can't speak for whoever designed solutionwatch but I can guarantee that I hadn't seen solutionwatch when I designed my site - I'm not sure who came first though. And to be honest, having been ripped off a fair bit myself, I really can't see how solutionwatch resembles my site at all (or vice-versa - like I said I don't know which came first - my site's current design is from about Feb/March 05) @Mb. -> I can’t speak for whoever designed solutionwatch but I can guarantee that I hadn’t seen solutionwatch when I designed my site - I’m not sure who came first though. And to be honest, having been ripped off a fair bit myself, I really can’t see how solutionwatch resembles my site at all (or vice-versa - like I said I don’t know which came first - my site’s current design is from about Feb/March 05)

]]> By: Martin http://mattbalara.com/2006/10/is-theft-in-the-eye-of-the-beholder.html#comment-9690 Martin Tue, 10 Oct 2006 12:11:54 +0000 http://mattbalara.com/design/is-theft-in-the-eye-of-the-beholder.html#comment-9690 No, my example wasn't a joke, it is just to show, that css based websites are using the same design elements (shadow, gradient on black, whitespace etc.). Falkner has copied structure, forms and colors, but the design wasn't very unique. Good design isn't very unique. Art is unique. You know <a href="http://www.werbeblogger.de/2006/09/25/plagiat-oder-zufall-metadesign-vs-buena-la-vista/" rel="nofollow">this discussion</a>? As for my statement, äääähm ... try to make a design for a music database software. I bet, it will always look like iTunes. Try to make a design for a tool to drive a nail into something and it always looks like a hammer. Try to create a better tool, and it will be very easy to copy it! I bet. No, my example wasn’t a joke, it is just to show, that css based websites are using the same design elements (shadow, gradient on black, whitespace etc.). Falkner has copied structure, forms and colors, but the design wasn’t very unique. Good design isn’t very unique. Art is unique.
You know this discussion?
As for my statement, äääähm … try to make a design for a music database software. I bet, it will always look like iTunes. Try to make a design for a tool to drive a nail into something and it always looks like a hammer. Try to create a better tool, and it will be very easy to copy it! I bet.

]]> By: Mb. http://mattbalara.com/2006/10/is-theft-in-the-eye-of-the-beholder.html#comment-9691 Mb. Mon, 09 Oct 2006 13:52:55 +0000 http://mattbalara.com/design/is-theft-in-the-eye-of-the-beholder.html#comment-9691 @Martin: you're joking, right? <a href="http://www.solutionwatch.com/" rel="nofollow" rel="nofollow" rel="nofollow">solutionwatch</a> and <a href="http://irishstu.com/" rel="nofollow" rel="nofollow" rel="nofollow">irishtu</a> look similar to each other, maybe similar enough that I'd be annoyed if I were the designer of whichever one came first, but the page structure, content presentation, etc. is different enough that it looks like a case of influence, not theft. But Faulkner has exactly the same structure as Joyent, in many cases down to the exact pixel measurements. The colours are changed, but changed so little as to unnoticeable without measuring them in Photoshop. The whole thing looks essentially like Faulkner's designers used Joyent as a template. In the sense that Joyent hasn't lost their site through Faulkner copying it, it is not stolen, no. My t.v. analogy is perhaps a poor one. Maybe the t.v. isn't gone, but you've come home to find your neighbours sitting on your couch watching your t.v. and drinking your beer. As for your "The better a design is, the easier it is to copy it" statement, I can't say I understand what you mean... @Martin: you’re joking, right? solutionwatch and irishtu look similar to each other, maybe similar enough that I’d be annoyed if I were the designer of whichever one came first, but the page structure, content presentation, etc. is different enough that it looks like a case of influence, not theft.

But Faulkner has exactly the same structure as Joyent, in many cases down to the exact pixel measurements. The colours are changed, but changed so little as to unnoticeable without measuring them in Photoshop. The whole thing looks essentially like Faulkner’s designers used Joyent as a template.

In the sense that Joyent hasn’t lost their site through Faulkner copying it, it is not stolen, no. My t.v. analogy is perhaps a poor one. Maybe the t.v. isn’t gone, but you’ve come home to find your neighbours sitting on your couch watching your t.v. and drinking your beer.

As for your “The better a design is, the easier it is to copy it” statement, I can’t say I understand what you mean…

]]> By: Martin Heike http://mattbalara.com/2006/10/is-theft-in-the-eye-of-the-beholder.html#comment-9692 Martin Heike Mon, 09 Oct 2006 10:25:46 +0000 http://mattbalara.com/design/is-theft-in-the-eye-of-the-beholder.html#comment-9692 Yes, Faulkner has been inspired by Joyent, but Joyent didn't create something unique. Take a look at all those css vault designs: They all base on some effects, structures, color schemes. Look at solutionwatch.com and irishstu.com for example. The design is not stolen, it is has been copied. The better a design is, the easier it is to copy it. The better an artwort is, the more difficult it is to copy it. The TV has not been stolen, your neighbour has just the same. Yes, Faulkner has been inspired by Joyent, but Joyent didn’t create something unique. Take a look at all those css vault designs: They all base on some effects, structures, color schemes. Look at solutionwatch.com and irishstu.com for example.

The design is not stolen, it is has been copied.

The better a design is, the easier it is to copy it. The better an artwort is, the more difficult it is to copy it.

The TV has not been stolen, your neighbour has just the same.

]]> By: Dave Brodbeck http://mattbalara.com/2006/10/is-theft-in-the-eye-of-the-beholder.html#comment-9693 Dave Brodbeck Mon, 02 Oct 2006 23:16:29 +0000 http://mattbalara.com/design/is-theft-in-the-eye-of-the-beholder.html#comment-9693 Not unlike Netscape stealing digg. I cannot stand this sort of thing, and I am with you Mb. Dave Not unlike Netscape stealing digg. I cannot stand this sort of thing, and I am with you Mb.

Dave

]]>